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London pollution charges and the CB500

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ceejay
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London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ceejay on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 2:03 pm

Alright most people who don't have to go near London are probably not bothered but I do for work occasionally, often on my CB500. I'm sure a few others do too. So the Ultra Low Emissions zone due to come in as early as 2019 basically means on a CB500 you will be charged going into the current congestion zone. A euro 3 bike would be okay. Now there is talk of a 'T Charge' which I don't really understand because it seems to suggest a euro 4 bike would be required to avoid a charge in the same zone.. if that's the case whats the point in the Ultra Low Emissions Zone? Or is it due to come in some time after?

Also what boring looking, cheap to run, surprisingly quick options would we have for bikes that meet these standards?  Smile
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louis_sutton
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by louis_sutton on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 4:52 pm

Re the charge coming in next year, if you check the exclusions, two wheelers are excluded... I hope
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ceejay
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ceejay on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 8:57 pm

Oh right, that's good news then.. Might be able to find a cheap enough euro 3 bike... like a cbf600 or something... euro 4 though might be a different matter. Seems like a stupid reason to get a new bike when I have a perfectly good one but would really be an inconvenience with my job at times!
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ZekeVal
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ZekeVal on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 9:26 pm

Consider yourself lucky guys, in Paris pre-2000 bikes are already forbidden as of this year on every working day.
Bikers are getting mad. And they want to extend this to most big cities in France...
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louis_sutton
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by louis_sutton on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 9:41 pm

Christ. I like my cb a lot more than I thought I would. I'm not sure what else will be as reliable, easy to work on, and go 170 miles between fuel stops (city miles). 

But yeah, I understood we dodge the interim thing next year, bit cop the lot from 2019, meaning we need a 2007 bike. 

Plus the congestion zone (which will still exist) is getting shoved out to the m25.

Makes me wonder what places like the ace and bike shed will do. 

Which reminds me, I'd like to get my cx running in time to take it into London...
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ashcroc
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ashcroc on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 10:25 pm

Well the goodish news is bikes only have to be built after 2007 & be Euro 3 compliant.

I'm mighty tempted to go the pre 1973 route just to stick 2 fingers up at them myself.
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liverpool_f_
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by liverpool_f_ on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 11:34 pm

The bikes don't have to be pre 1973 ashcroc. Bikes over 40 years old will be exempt meaning in 2020, a bike from 1980 is acceptable. I have been racking my brain to think up a 1980 frame that will easily accept later more powerful/reliable engine, transmission, brakes etc. No great solutions yet. (No,vfr 750 motors and transmissions don't easily fit into vf frames!)

It does look like the end for the humble cb in London. My only saving grace was that I was hoping that I could put 100k on the cb before 2020 and retire it from everyday hack duties to weekend leisure duty. Might not achieve that by 2019 but I will try.
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ashcroc
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ashcroc on Sat 22 Oct 2016, 12:19 pm

That's the problem with linking to .gov websites. It always seems to involve searching elsewhere for the correct info.

You're quite correct assuming the government don't decide to stop the roll of the 'historic' vehicle tax exemption.  The pre 1973 bit seems to just be an extra to cover commercial vehicles & throw people off.

I doubt there are many new engines that'll fit easily in an older frame. Once you start thinkinng of modifying a frame to fit, it opens the doors to grafting a cb500 frame to an old headstock so you can use the old V5.
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louis_sutton
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by louis_sutton on Sat 22 Oct 2016, 2:17 pm

Oooo my cx is a 1980 reg. Doesn't run, but that's useful to know
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ceejay
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by ceejay on Sat 22 Oct 2016, 11:31 pm

Vehicles built before 1 January 1973 will also be exempt from ULEZ. These vehicles were built
before emissions standards came into force and are exempted because of their unsuitability for
engine conversion or replacement.

'unsuitability for engine conversion'.... so that is a possible thing with post - 1 Jan 1973 vehicles?! (pretty sure it's not but just find their reasoning strange)

To be fair the chances are I might have a new bike by then anyway so I guess I better make sure it is a >2007 bike. I love the logic of buying a pre-1981 bike to make a statement but realistically I probably won't be able to afford the time and effort to make something suitable.... but will keep an open mind, I guess many of the parts (brakes, suspension) could be modernised relatively easily. 

Congestion charge being put out to M25 would be ridiculous! I understand that these pollutants are bad and need to go etc but does it make much difference to just wait a little bit longer till the older vehicles die out 'naturally' like the rest of the country...
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liverpool_f_
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by liverpool_f_ on Sun 23 Oct 2016, 2:36 am

Speaking of old frames and new engines, the best I have come up with so far is a Yamaha SR500 from 1980 with a late 90's engine, box and brakes etc. The design is essentially the same, just means that you have newer running gear if it is going to be an everyday hack.
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eternally_troubled
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by eternally_troubled on Wed 26 Oct 2016, 8:49 am

The world has gone crazy Smile The amount of emissions from PTW (powered two wheelers, in the jargon) is crazy-small compared the many, many times more emissions from cars, usually with fewer occupants per seat. The stupid thing is that bikes should be part of the answer to the congestion/emissions problems....

Anyway, you'll just need to wait until 2033 - 2040 and then you'll be able to use a 1993-2000 CB500. You just need to keep it in a shed (or use it only outside London) until then Smile
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louis_sutton
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Re: London pollution charges and the CB500

Post by louis_sutton on Sun 30 Oct 2016, 8:37 am

Consultation time again...

https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/environment/air-quality-consultation-phase-2/?cid=airquality-consultation

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